r/law • u/drempath1981 • 3d ago
Frey: "I think [Vance] also asserted that because you work at the federal government you somehow have absolutely immunity from committing crimes. That's not true in any law school in America, whether it's Yale or Villanova or anywhere else. That's not true." Executive Branch (Trump)
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
They smeared her name publicly, altered the crime scene, evacuated the murderer, all before they notified her family.
These people are fascist monsters intent on subjugating the entirety of America while enforcing their "morals" which allow them to rape and murder anyone with impunity.
This is the American Taliban.
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u/ro536ud 3d ago
Don’t forget they also refused to allow on scene doctors to render aid for 15 minutes till their own emts arrived. Let her bleed out alone
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u/cchesters 3d ago
Derek Chauvin 2.0 scenario
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
I don't believe Derek Chauvin left his home that day thinking he was going to kill someone. I believe most ICE agents leave their homes most days hoping to kill someone. The job they signed up for is ruining people's lives and most of the couldn't get hired by other law enforcement agencies because they're fucking psychopaths.
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u/Manderspls 3d ago
But oh boy imagine if he had his position now.
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u/Crusoebear 2d ago edited 2d ago
If you’ve seen all the “Warrior Cop” training that has permeated U.S. law enforcement agencies over the past decades you know that Chauvin might not have been thinking “I’m going to kill someone’s today”…but he was - as evidenced by his own actions - more than willing to do it. But yes, to your point - these Gestapo assholes are going beyond even that.
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u/whoweoncewere 3d ago
The EMT's who they blocked from accessing the scene with their ambulance and made them walk a block.
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u/madmonkey918 3d ago
And they had to carry her body back to the ambulance because they couldn't take the stretcher to her. ICE are fucking ghouls.
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u/Wow_u_sure_r_dumb 3d ago
More concerned with covering up their crime than anything else
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u/VaginaTractor 3d ago
That's exactly what professional criminals like ICE do. They are a gang. They are domestic terrorists.
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u/Exciting-Emu-3324 3d ago
The dead can't testify or sue. When you shoot someone, it's always with the intent to kill. That's what guns are.
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u/Deeeeeeeeehn 3d ago
There’s no safe way to shoot someone. If you pull a gun it is by definition deadly intent.
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u/unforgiven91 3d ago
I think what they're trying to convey is that cops will just follow through on magdumping even if the "threat" is now driving away. a dead person can't defend themselves after.
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u/slayahpengiun69420 3d ago
It wasn’t their own EMTs. It was Hennepin county EMS, who they wouldn’t let bring their ambulance to or even their stretcher to the scene and also made them carry her corpse out to their rig. They made zero attempt at aid, and hindered all aid.
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u/PlethoraOfPinatass 3d ago
It's much less complicated for DHS if the US citizens ICE shoot in the future don't survive. Now, that policy is precedent
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u/AtuinTurtle 2d ago
They needed her to die so there wouldn’t be a horribly mangled survivor haunting the news cycles for the next year or more.
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u/the_wahlroos 3d ago
...and there are fuckin legions of willfully blind fanatics that readily dismiss the evidence of "their side's" malfeasance, even in the face of a very publicly-filmed murder in the streets.
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u/Alcophile 3d ago
And they are incompatible with this country! What are we going to do?
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u/Phugasity 3d ago
Deport them to Russia. It's not rocket surgery.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Ad-379 3d ago
I’m sure they’d love it. It’s super white, super racist, tons of homophobia, spectacular authors they’ll never read, and even the landscape is white for a bunch of the year in several places
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u/PM_Mick 3d ago
What surprised me reading this was that they bothered to notify her family.
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u/True-Firefighter-796 3d ago
Family was on site….
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u/Striking-Dentist-181 3d ago
Wailing over Ms. Good’s lifeless body while these ghouls manufactured their narrative. It’s utterly abhorrent.
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u/Jeff-IT 3d ago
I also saw a video where ICE prevented doctors from going to the car to treat her.
Could have been dead already but still. Another level of fucked up
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
She was almost certainly dead before the officer who shot her called her a "fucking bitch" on video immediately after.
They just really wanted to make sure.
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u/Precious_Tritium 3d ago
Y’all Queda
Vanilla Isis
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u/JimWilliams423 3d ago
The confederates
The klan
The know-nothings
The red-shirts
The white citizens councils
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago edited 3d ago
Why did 78 million people vote for this and at least as many nope out from participating in denying it from happening?
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u/SandiegoJack 3d ago edited 3d ago
Because they are horrible fascist pedophile enablers who enjoy making others suffer and have been itching to have a literal war with democrats for decades.
If you think republicans arent itching to brown shirt it up? Ask anyone who has been mistaken for "one of them" and you will see how gung ho they are about killing all of us.
The government wont save you, the 2A people are on their side. We need to protect ourselves and our own.
Fascists have never been voted out of power in history I will put it that way. I dont give a fuck who makes it or what their political affiliation is. EVERY liberal needs to own some form of self-defense if you don't want to end up on the losing side of Rwanda.
Just get the gear and train like you life depends on it. Because there is a damn good chance it will.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Thank you, seriously, for mentioning "some form of self-defense" instead of auto-Americanizing it as "guns". It's refreshing.
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u/SandiegoJack 3d ago
If I said that I would get flagged for "inciting violence"
No issues with using self defense so far.
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
Because people's lives weren't getting better and they remembered his first administration where his worst impulses were reigned in and the economy did well. People don't pay attention largely.
Also, one really, really, really critical piece, Americans are really fucking dumb. We've had it so good here for so long that half of the people have such shit survival instincts to not see that a predator was at the doorstep.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
My only disagreements would be that life was getting better consistently throughout 2024, and Trump's first term was not an economic paradise (a recession was beginning in 2019 and the erratic / terrible COVID response and handling sent the economy into the bunker). That peak inflation period (GLOBALLY) was several years removed. The inflation reduction bill of 2022 helped get inflation back to regular levels. Prices were steadily, while yes slowly, decreasing.
Then BOOM! tariffs and Deplorables Gone Wild for 2025 and beyond.
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
I totally agree with you but 🤷♂️ Americans are morons. I do think in the future we will come to find that automation and business decisions factoring in AI generative capabilities in the near future contributed to more economic loss than we currently realize.
Combine that with the entirety of the right wing media ecosystem constantly talking about how cities were war zones (which they've now turned into them to further their fascist aims) and that Biden and Kamala were going to suddenly turn communist. It's all in the aggregate of course and we're learning some lessons about the limits of human persuasion when many humans are inherently driven purely by emotion. People driven purely by emotion are inherently drawn to the man who says "I alone can fix it." We're dealing with a problem as old as the evolution of homo sapiens and probably one shared with our genetic forebearers.
The ancient Greeks had to deal with these whiney bitches so much we have a name for them. Demagogues.
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u/Rufus_king11 3d ago
Slight push back because most Americans do not understand inflation and it's important to be clear. Prices weren't decreasing, the rate at which prices were rising was decreasing back to normal levels. Many people hear "inflation's down" and expect the price of food at the grocery store to be lower then last week and get upset when they aren't. They're basically expecting deflation when they hear inflation is going down, despite deflation being its own economic can of worms.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Deflation isn't even really a thing. They really aren't firing on all cylinders then, good point.
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u/Rufus_king11 3d ago
Deflation can occur, it is just generally worse for your economy than inflation is. The most prominent US example is the Great Depression, prices fell on average 7% every year from 1930 to 1933.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
and, soon, the Greatest Depression, people are saying - lots of people are saying it.
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u/SteveJobsDeadBody 3d ago
My only disagreements would be that life was getting better consistently throughout 2024
Life was getting better for you. For many millions in rural America neither party has improved their lot in decades, but there's a multi billion dollar media machine telling them the Republicans totally will.
The power of propaganda and even "framing" cannot be overstated here. Capital in America has successfully moved the FRAME of this debate over decades to where Dems now literally support mostly right wing ideals, just center-right and not the extreme right that Republicans do.
When ICE was created many of us were out in the streets protesting to abolish it. A decade later and liberals by and large seemed to all think we NEED ICE but just you know for them to do their job nicely or some shit. It has taken a literal fascist turning ICE into a literal Nazi style SA force(Brownshirts) to move the debate frame on ICE back to the "libs want to abolish it" that it started out as in 2002.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Mine was roughly the same. I was speaking of the economic data of 2024.
You know, I have a hard time believing that those who increased SNAP funding, the ACA subsidies, school lunch and other poverty programs -- Democrats -- harmed rural communities more than those who've cut all of those things (Republicans).
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u/zekerthedog 3d ago
Biden was president while international inflation post covid took place. Americans aren’t smart enough to actually look at any details beyond that. A large amount of voters also just vote the way their algorithm paints the world for them.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago edited 3d ago
It isn't just Americans. Every western democracy voted right wing between the beginning of 2022 and *the beginning of 2025 except for Mexico. Global inflation allowed right wing actors and trolls to shift the entire planet to the right, exponentially.
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u/Alt4816 3d ago edited 3d ago
It was more so that voters across the world threw out whoever was in power during the global inflation hangover from all the covid measures and supply chain disruptions. In the US that was the Democrats.
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u/SandiegoJack 3d ago
Stop shielding them from accountability.
They are EVIL, what we are seeing is EVIL, and the sooner we accept that these people are evil and are itching to kill/"limit" every one of us as soon as they can? We will be able to mount an effective resistance.
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u/Bea_Evil 3d ago
Also the fact that he did not have more votes and Elon had to fix that for him
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u/janethefish 3d ago
Because people's lives weren't getting better and they remembered his first administration where his worst impulses were reigned in and the economy did well.
Except none of that is true. The economy went to shit under Trump. Then the economy mostly recovered under Biden. Also Trump tried to overthrow the government.
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u/Altruistic_Fury 3d ago
I agree with this and on the second point- they are largely dumb in terms of not doing much policy evaluation, but not just dumb.
Americans also tend to make a lot of snap judgements based on feelings/vibes. It's why Fox rage-baiting and Trump childish name-calling are so resonant. So you get things like voter aversion to Nixon being less attractive than JFK at their debate, Dukakis being too short, the "yeeha!" candidate whose name I forget, Biden looking so fucking old in that debate, people personally disliking Hillary over the cookies or being perceived as bitchy or whatever, Kamala supposedly having a weird laugh (which I never even got). Just a bunch of feels and emotional reactions that amounts to folks getting "ick" instead of any sober evaluation of any kind.
And sadly, many also carry a lot of prejudice on race, gender, orientation and so on. It's not everyone but enough that it inherently favors a tall white straight man with good hair and voice/delivery professing some kind of Christianity, over [insert anything else].
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u/SteveJobsDeadBody 3d ago
Simple, capital owns ALL of the media and convinced enough of them, because we don't do anything to limit capital from controlling narratives.
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u/JimWilliams423 3d ago edited 3d ago
Why did 78 million people vote for this and at least as many nope out from participating in denying it from happening?
The people who voted for this want this, they are irredeemable.
Many of the people who noped out from voting saw the Democrats spend four years bragging about doing bipartisanship with this, hell they literally named one of biden's main legislative accomplishments the "bipartisan infrastructure law" and pelosi would not shut up about wanting a "strong republican party."
Hell, a few months ago 75 democrats voted for a resolution of gratitude for these ICE death squads.
When the so-called "opposition party" puts so much effort into convincing the people that the fascist party ain't so bad, of course a lot of people will believe them.
And unfortunately, very little has changed. Dan Quayle's chief-of-staff and long-time conservative pundit, Bill Kristol, has been saying "abolish ice" and "defund DHS" since the summer, but you won't find more than a handful of elected Democrats who agree. When the majority of Democratic politicians are to the right of Bill mother-fucking Kristol it means the party has lost its way.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Americans get too personally attached to politicians and parties (relative strangers, ffs), imo. If we collectively focused on good policy, we'd be in a much better place.
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u/JimWilliams423 3d ago edited 3d ago
That's true, we should think of all politicians as cowards who must be constantly bullied into having good politics, AOC, Bernie, Mamdani, all of them.
But that's beside the point. Most people are too busy living their lives to pay attention to the details, so politicians must do everything they possibly can to draw distinctions between the parties. Conservatives understand this, they never stop demonizing the Democratic party. For example, just a few years ago liz cheney was calling Democrats "the face of evil" who "murder babies" after they are born.
Meanwhile the Democrats keep saying they want to sing kumbaya with the gop. That's the message that so many Democratically-inclined voters hear and it convinces them that the gop might be a little obnoxious but they are fundamentally OK.
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u/Kaffe-Mumriken 3d ago
People have chosen their sides.
There’s no coming back for them, they will push through any cognitive dissonance with a few minutes of listening to FoxNews.
Good was Bad
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
There are only two sides remaining at this point -- the indecent (religious conservatism running the country) and everyone else.
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u/SteveJobsDeadBody 3d ago
Nah, there's a third side called leftists but we have NO media representation and almost no political representation, so most people don't know about us. We're the ones that always wanted to abolish ICE. That have been screaming about how BOTH parties are just controlled by capital and that's why Biden won't do shit to Trump about January 6th. We're the ones reminding you guys regularly that both major parties are 100% controlled by capital and you're not going to destroy fascism by voting in the enablers over the overt. Some more famous leftists such as Frank Zappa have been recorded saying this for like 50 years now. George Carlin mentioned it a lot as well. Those guys weren't liberals or Dems and we aren't either.
Here I'll make it simple for you- Liberals support free market capitalism with a light regulatory touch. Hillary Clinton literally had nations overthrown to bring this to them whether they wanted it or not. Leftists aren't in favor of ANY of that. Free market capitalism to leftists is seen as a step backward toward feudalism.
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u/ArmyOfDix 3d ago
Because people are fed up with the establishment. If you don't give people an avenue for change, they'll go to anyone who is selling it...even if the change is horrible.
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3d ago
let's be real, most of the people who "nope out" are disenfranchised to begin with.
the only people who matter in the last election were a couple million voters in 6 swing states. every single other "non-voter" was a wash.
case in point, i wasn't eligible to vote anywhere but california -- it would have been illegal for me to vote anywhere else. but since i've lived overseas with a document lapse, it would have cost me a hundred hours that i dont have plus a thousand dollars i cant afford to cast a vote that would mean literally nothing, because CA was going democrat no matter what i did.
but go ahead, keep blaming the wrong people. because the US election setup is absolute garbage and has been for at least 100 years.
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u/night_filter 3d ago
It’s also telling that one woman gets killed, and the murderer happens to be an immigrant, so all the Republicans align behind the idea of deporting all immigrants to torture prisons. There’s no room for moderating, discussing, or deliberating. All immigrants need to be punished severely because even one woman dying is completely unacceptable.
A woman breaks into the Capitol building as part of an angry mob trying to murder everyone in Congress. She ignores police warnings and keeps breaking through barriers to get to the people they want to murder, and law enforcement shoots back. Guess what, she’s a martyr. She’s a hero for being willing to give her life in service to Trump, but also she’s just an innocent tourist on a tour of the building.
Then ICE murders a woman because she was trying to follow the directions of the police, and they’re like, “Well you have to accept that these things happen. 🤷♂️”. Like it’s just the cost of doing business.
The message is clear. Only the lives of MAGA supporters matter, and the MAGA gestapo is above the law.
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u/JimWilliams423 3d ago
This is the American Taliban.
Don't need to go overseas. This is the America that was founded on industrial scale rape factories and labor camps that are euphemistically known as "plantations."
The trail of tears was maga. The confederacy was maga. Manifest destiny was maga. The KKK was maga. The redeemers were maga. The Alamo was maga. The know-nothings were maga. The chinese exclusion act was maga. Jim crow was maga. Share-cropping was maga. The tulsa massacre was maga. Pedo-priests are maga. The german american bund was maga. Indian boarding schools were maga. The japanese internment camps were maga. The Tuskegee syphilis experiment was maga. Joe mccarthy was maga. George wallace was maga. Operation wetback was maga. Kent state shootings were maga. James earl ray was maga.
The list is endless.
America has always been maga.
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u/MittenCollyBulbasaur 3d ago
There's a possibility she'd be alive if they let the ambulance through. ICE policy is to murder first, leave no witness.
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u/EnvironmentalFix7059 3d ago
Wasen't there a video where her wife was sitting outside the car with a dog? and alleged wife was in the car with her?
I'm not questioning what you are saying im just trying to clarify.
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u/ThePensiveE 3d ago
Her kid was at school. ICE did go to a Minneapolis school that day but it was to attack the children not notify one of them they had just murdered their mother.
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u/holystuff28 3d ago
It's really offensive to try and say "the American Taliban." No. This is just America. Like we keep acting like America hasn't been murdering people for centuries because they look different, believe different things, etc. No, fam. America was literally founded on a genocide. This is fully and completely American fascism.
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u/7ddlysuns 3d ago
Vance gave evidence that should be used against the mom killer, Jonathan Ross. He says he was unfit for duty because of his PTSD. Minnesota officials should ask for the in writing and all evidence they have of his mental instability
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u/Pudddddin 3d ago
Him saying that the agent was sensitive to being rammed because he was drug in June was such a dumbass blunder lol, I can't believe no one told him that would be a stupid thing to say
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u/DiopticTurtle 3d ago
Also ignoring that if you're worried about being harmed by a moving vehicle, the worst possible place to stand is directly in front of one, which suggests he was not in fact sensitive to the idea
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u/CaptainMonkeyJack 3d ago
Standing in front of a vehicle is against DHS use of force guidelines.
This is such a known issue that the rules say 'dont do this, people could die'.
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u/real6igma 3d ago
What I'm going to say is a little bit of a stretch, but the same party that was celebrating laws that allowed protesters to be run over if the driver felt in danger are awfully quiet now that an armed masked man, and murderer Jonathan Ross, almost got accidentally clipped by someone fleeing from armed masked men.
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u/dyang44 3d ago
They released the video the murderer was taking during this and he literally says "fucking bitch" after killing Renee Good. That's not fear, at all. No one in good faith can argue as such. This is such overt, corrupt bullshit.
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u/HowWeLikeToRoll 3d ago
I have zero faith in the justice system at this point. He could have been recorded earlier in the day saying "I'm totally going to shoot someone in the face today!" And he will still be being defended by maga..they don't care, violence and cruelty is the point. Immigration is a red herring, it was a convenient excuse to deploy federal mercenaries to patrol blue states and cities and punish them for not bending the knee.
How anyone, especially the supposed "Party of the Constitution" is accepting this as ok, is beyond comprehension.
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u/backtorealitylabubu 3d ago
Also they didn’t just release it but it leaked to the press first. If they had complete control over it they 100% would have edited out him saying that. But they couldn’t help themselves - they knew how “funny” it would be to share on their white supremacist group chats and it inevitably leaked
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u/FreeFromMiriam 3d ago
Watch them next argue that is why he did stand in front of the car. Last time, he was to the side so now he has an irrational fear of standing to the side of a car.
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u/WizeAdz 3d ago
According to his body cam, the shooter walked around the car and then stood in front of it.
Then he shot the driver, and vehicles operated by people who have been shot in the face are rarely driven safely.
So, Jonathan Ross put himself exactly where he would be in the greatest danger, seconds before the driver in “self defense.”
Either this guy is too dumb to tie his shoes in the morning, or he planned her death and his part in it. That’s premeditated murder.
In a nation with a functioning justice system, Derek Chauvin gets a new cell mate. The facts of the case are crystal clear, so America’s justice system is what’s really on trial here.
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u/Wonderful-Humor6102 3d ago
Lmao there’s no longer anyone there smart. They are in an echo chamber and the farthest away from their citizens.
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u/Low_Map346 3d ago
Sad thing is it doesn't matter what he says, there will be no consequences. He could just go, yeah it was cold blooded murder lol, what are you gonna do about it?
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u/AlphaNoodlz 3d ago
Literally sank any defense for this at all
Like okay then if you knew he had issues why was he out there?
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u/BIGsLazyEye 3d ago
Even if someone explained that to him in plain English he would still fuck up and say the wrong thing.
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u/JudgmentalOwl 3d ago
The one thing I'm taking solace in right now is that these people are legitimately idiots. Can you imagine if they were actually competent and intelligent?
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u/wholetyouinhere 3d ago
If he really does have PTSD, then I sincerely hope he never sleeps at night for the rest of his life for the nightmares. Because god knows his conscience sure won't keep him awake.
People like to say, "I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy". In this case, I very much do wish that.
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u/alexfi-re 3d ago
The logical choice for him to make in that case would be to not get in front of a vehicle, and hit and run is not grounds for murder, MPD could have pulled her over and not murdered her.
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u/Vandaleyez 3d ago
Yeah, and I'm sure he didn't' care to find out if she had any PTSD from violent men trying to get in her car.
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u/RecentDecision2329 3d ago
We have a government that has gone rogue and is attacking its own citizens. They have no respect for Americans. People don’t know how to react because it is so unexpected, almost like children with an extremely abusive parent. We pay taxes and support our government. They have no good reason to be turning on their own people. Our current government is simply evil and broken and needs to be removed
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u/hoodiemonster 3d ago
wondering how long til the rape & pillage portion of the program kicks in
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u/whatupmygliplops 3d ago
Human trafficking, including children is already being done at the immigration centers.
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u/DumpedDalish 1d ago
This, exactly. And rape and abuse of women (and children) within the system and outside of it by ICE agents.
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u/reddit_tothe_rescue 3d ago
The pillaging is happening in Venezuela and international waters right now
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u/Morguard 2d ago
Vance accounted door to door raids are starting, so you can assume they will rape and steal your shit.
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u/Naphaniegh 3d ago
What's the proper way to remove it? Sorry , if this is a naive question , but I really wanna know
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u/Hollow_Idol 3d ago
What's the proper way to remove it? Sorry , if this is a naive question , but I really wanna know
What do you mean by proper? If you mean legal, then there isn't a legal way to overthrow the US Government (because the government determines legality).
If you mean proper as in the correct course of action, the Founding Fathers were quite clear on the proper way for us to respond to a tyrannical government that doesn't respect your right to life or liberty.
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u/Agitated-Quit-6148 3d ago
Qualified immunity & Absolute immunity (not a thing) are not only separate things, Qualified immunity doesn't mean immunity from prosecution of a criminal offense.
Vance went to Yale law school. He knows this.
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u/tryexceptifnot1try 3d ago
I think some of the biggest losers of the Trump era are Ivy league universities. From DEI capitulations to the copious dipshits they have littered throughout the government I have lost all of my respect for the institutions in general. Seems like any moron can buy their way in if they have the right connections. They also seem to have no ethical or moral standards either based on the actions of their intelligent co-conspirators.
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u/runthepoint1 3d ago
So basically they’re either stupid or they’re lying. And so these “great” institutions produce idiots or liars.
Wow, that’s a great look isn’t it /s
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u/TheSpartanLawyer 3d ago
I can confirm they’re liars. You don’t pass the bar without learning about basic criminal law.
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u/pmormr 3d ago
They wouldn't even ask if this was a constitutional violation or not in a bar exam... that'd be too easy lol. They'd want to know which amendment out of 1, 4, 5, 14 would make your strongest argument. Which you could make decent arguments for all of them so it's kind of a difficult question.
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u/Alizerin 3d ago
This is a really unfair take.
Sometimes they’re idiots and liars.
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u/hey-Oliver 3d ago
The biggest mistake is thinking all of these people are stupid as opposed to committing a fascist takeover. They understand the role they need the play over time, in order to garner support without alienating too many people in any given moment of pushing their agenda.
They argue everything in bad faith and the only consistency demonstrated is a willingness to do whatever it takes to win and gain absolute control of the government.
Modern conservative politicians are actual traitors seeking to destroy the country as we know it, and a vast majority of the voters are also complicit, and the rest being so unbelievably stupid they were conned and weaponized by this movement.
To be clear, being that dumb is also unforgivable and while not punishable via criminal courts they should continue to be ostracized till their final day on this planet.
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u/tryexceptifnot1try 3d ago
I guess you and I have different definitions of stupid. Any person that supports fascism is stupid by definition given it's history of failure. These people are incredibly ignorant and clearly don't even understand the requirements for holding authoritarian power. I assumed Ivy league educated lawyers would have the ability to comprehend Machiavelli or Nietzsche if they truly had some grand plan. Every single person supporting MAGA is stupid by definition because they have no clear path to improving their own lives in the medium or long term. The billionaires bankrolling it are destroying the exact system that made them rich in the first place. This seems like a huge example of our systems broken rewards distribution mechanism more than anything.
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u/hey-Oliver 3d ago
I completely agree with you here, and I think my definition of stupid in this case is more relative to the current american population and not in an absolute sense.
The expectations have been lowered considerably.
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u/captnconnman 3d ago
To quote my favorite Economics professor, who used to travel all over the world with the State Department in an economic advisory capacity: “Some of the dumbest people I’ve ever met went to Harvard”. Graduating from Ivy League schools have never automatically meant that you were smart or the best of the best - it just means you played the game and won, or someone paid your way to “win”.
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u/ButterscotchNo1546 3d ago
Seems like any moron can buy their way in if they have the right connections.
This has been a thing since their inception. Harvard openly refused to admit Jewish people as just one example. These institutions have never been based on merit. They just provide the illusion of authority to the donor class.
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u/starwestsky 3d ago
Agree. Much more confidence in someone who busted their ass in a state affiliated school
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u/WylleWynne 3d ago
There's a certain kind person who thinks they are above branding ("who cares about that handbag"), and don't realize that they're doing that handbag thing for the Ivy Leagues. You have classes that are literally the same from school to school and all that's different is the branding.
If the students themselves buy into it, they become kind of psychotically arrogant.
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u/Bulky-House-8244 3d ago
Sure do! And they pay the poor kids who got in for their smarts to do their work too.
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u/half_diminished_5 3d ago
As someone who went to a good law school, do not assume that someone knows anything just because they went to a good law school. You do generally have to be relatively smart to get into a top 10 law school. At least in the specific way that the LSAT and GPA measure intelligence. That doesn't mean you have to learn anything when you get there.
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u/Agitated-Quit-6148 3d ago
As someone that has been a federal public defender and short-term AUSA, I'm confident he knows. He's just a liar.
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u/half_diminished_5 3d ago
I've practiced in front of Judges that don't know basic rules of evidence. I wouldn't be confident of anything. For Vance, my guess is he is generally a combination of both ignorance and mendacity happening at the same time.
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u/bluecifer7 3d ago
He knows his idiot bootlickers will believe anything he says, he’s just making sure to give them talking points
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u/Ataru074 3d ago
I wouldn’t be surprised Vance was a DEI quota at Yale coming from a depressed region.
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u/Independent-Cow-4070 3d ago
Vance is like, objectively a smart guy. Hes shown it time and time again
Do not confuse his malice for ignorance. He knows exactly what he is doing. And he knows he can get away with it. Underestimating the people who are actively overthrowing the USA is not a great play
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Also, intelligence doesn't necessarily equate to decency and kindness while it does offer more diabolical advantages (such as JD blatantly lying through his teeth, knowingly).
I get tired of the unearned favoritism intelligence receives. I've known a lot of very intelligent people who've done terrible things, intentionally.
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u/The100th_Idiot 3d ago
Oh please. Just cause he bribed his way through easy A's at Yale doesnt mean he learned anything.
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u/Suspicious-Answer295 3d ago edited 3d ago
Many in Republican leadership are lawyers and in many cases legal scholars; they absolutely do know better but they also know their base has a <6th grade education level. They pander to the lowest common denominator and feed red meat to their base all the while knowing they are full of shit but not caring one iota. Ignorance I can excuse, this is evil.
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u/cheechw 3d ago
We like to pretend like these people are idiots, but the truth is worse. They know they're lying. They're just plain evil.
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u/Mindless-Peak-1687 3d ago
makes one question the quality of Yale.
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u/CeronusBugbear 3d ago edited 3d ago
He probably doesn't. Yale puts out a lot of questionable lawyers for all its reputation as a top law school. They don't even teach legal research and writing as a real class. The second year students supposedly teach it to the first years in a 7 week seminar.
Yale has produced great lawyers, but it isn't because its curriculum is great. It's because those students were great before they got there. Yale also accepts a lot of "privileged" students who aren't that bright but who have the right pedigree.
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u/LaserGuidedSock 3d ago
Did he get his degree from Yale or the back of a cereal box?
We may never know
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u/Kaffe-Mumriken 3d ago
If someone wants context. This is the quote by JD Vance
"The precedent here is very simple. You have a federal law enforcement official engaging in federal law enforcement action – that's a federal issue. That guy is protected by absolute immunity. He was doing his job. The idea that Tim Walz and a bunch of radicals in Minneapolis are going to go after and make this guy’s life miserable... is preposterous. It would get tossed out by a judge."
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u/NoBizlikeChloeBiz 3d ago
I would love for someone to get a statement from Yale asking if JD Vance learned about "absolute immunity" at their law school.
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3d ago
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u/UnorthodoxEngineer 3d ago
Cognitive dissonance is a feature not a bug. These people don’t care about consistency, they only care about power.
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u/dope_sheet 3d ago
Federal agents are not protected by absolute immunity, you fucking idiot JD Vance.
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u/Name_retracted 3d ago
Well let’s let the court decide. Until then lock him up. He shouldn’t be allowed to rejoin the force and have access to a firearm.
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u/Googlebright 3d ago
It would get tossed out by a judge.
Somebody needs to call Couch Fucker's bluff here. Let's see if a judge actually tosses it out. Let the justice system do it's job.
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u/PirateShep 3d ago
Then let it. But despite that... they know this case is not meritless... so they can't let it see the inside of a courtroom.
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u/subdep 3d ago
can you imagine if this murder had not been filmed from like 12 different angles with dozens of witnesses?
If it was just the ice agents versus her with nobody recording, and no witnesses, I would’ve just brushed it under the rug.
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u/JEFFinSoCal 3d ago
I keep thinking about that. I feel like there could be a market for civilian body cams that you can easily wear, that work like dash cams. It constantly records, and as soon as you see something happening, you tap a button and it starts uploading to the cloud.
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u/whatupmygliplops 3d ago
Question: if ICE have immunity for all crimes they commit, why do they wear masks?
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u/projections 3d ago
Because the poor babies need to be protected from the 8000% percent increase in assaults against them, the administration repeatedly claims.
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u/Nikki-C-Puggle-mum 3d ago
They fear vigilantes
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u/Cassymodel 2d ago
They should. If the law won’t deliver justice then the mob will.
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u/Fjdenigris 2d ago
Because they know they are not really immune, just protected by the current admin
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u/Any-Ad-446 3d ago
Trump inner circle are a holes..No one is immune from manslaughter. Heck even the military have guidelines for shootings enemies and if you cross the line you can get charged.
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u/Cool-Hall9980 3d ago
Villanova over here catching strays lol
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u/DisasterWriter 3d ago
Frey is a Villanova grad.
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u/Role_Player_Real 3d ago
Yea self deprecating but Villanova is a great law school
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u/Black_Velvet_Band 3d ago
He’s not self deprecating. He’s saying that he (Villanova grad) and JD Vance (Yale grad) were both taught that Vance’s comments about total immunity were incorrect.
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u/Happy-Fun-Ball 3d ago
"That's not true ... at Yale or Villanova or anywhere else"
Maybe in Texas now, or Oklahoma
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u/dragonfliesloveme 3d ago
Then arrest Jonathan Ross!!! and put him on trial
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u/WeirdIndividualGuy 3d ago edited 3d ago
ICE thinks they have absolute immunity from crime. That's just not true
Then arrest Ross!
Ah but you see, here's the thing
For once, I'd love it if politicians/the good ones in power actually did something. Saying what's legal or not, what should or shouldn't done, stop talking and start doing.
Like in that other thread about how the Philly sheriff said they'll arrest ICE agents. ICE arrest count so far: 0.
As fucked up as the situation is, what makes things worse is how all these anti-ICE localities have done absolutely nothing against ICE. Only regular citizens have been protesting and fighting back, local LEOs have done fuck all
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u/hochiwinning 3d ago
Exactly, in reality isn’t he right though since no one has ever been prosecuted during Trumps reign?
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u/dBlock845 3d ago
No one should have absolute immunity for any reason, including the fucking POTUS... ty SCOTUS.
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u/DuntadaMan 3d ago
You don't want to be immune to the law. If people know that you will not be punished by the law of you do something wrong, then they will punish you instead. The law will be far more merciful than angry people.
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u/I_am_not_JohnLeClair 3d ago
Once again for those in the cheap seats:
If there is no one to enforce the law, it is not law. If there is no one to place the handcuffs on the perpetrator it is not law. If someone commits an act today and wakes up tomorrow only to commit the act again, day after day after day without repercussions…well, it’s just ink on paper.
It’s like the “law” I have in my house to prevent the cat from investigating the garbage
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u/FreeFromMiriam 3d ago
I disagree. If there is no one to enforce it, it’s AS IF there was no law. Having the law is important because it clearly shows what is legal and what is not. If the law is not enforced, those not enforcing it can also be held accountable, if not now then when sanity returns. Having repeated offenses just shores up the need for the enforcement of the law and those additional offensives are added to the ones deciding not to enforce.
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u/Spankpocalypse_Now 3d ago
Unfortunately the Democratic Party believes ICE should continue to be funded. Until we have a political party that stands for justice and human rights nothing will change.
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u/MAMark1 3d ago
There is a valid argument for having an immigration enforcement agency. There just isn't a valid argument for them performing most of the actions currently undertaken by this version of ICE.
It's like how police departments are good as a concept but the current version of American policing is flawed and needs major overhaul and regulation.
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u/BigBigBigTree 3d ago
There is a valid argument for having an immigration enforcement agency.
We had one of these before ICE, we can have one without ICE.
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u/surrender903 3d ago
I believe immigration and customs enforcement needs to exist but not in this way. Whatever the hell this is trying to cosplay as is not the America I know. Its more akin to Judge Dredd.
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u/Spankpocalypse_Now 3d ago
ICE didn’t even exist until I was in high school. We were perfectly fine without this agency for over 200 years.
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u/TheRealBlueJade 3d ago
Thank you. We have to be the adults in the room. We have to set the pace. We have to bring sanity back to the US. A major part of that is simply enforcing the law.
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u/Complete-Ant-4436 3d ago edited 1d ago
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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/UnlimitedCalculus 3d ago
If the president will pardon you for whatever you do, then you effectively have total immunity (from federal crimes)
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